Slickness is overrate....

[Dr Oldz]

I often see post about coatings not being slick to the touch and what to do to improve that feel...for instance .....using reload or hydro2 ontop of a costing to achieve this......


It has been my experience with UK and Finest to just leave them alone. If you want easy rinse ability and that "stay clean" effect.... Do not top the coatings. They may not feel slick but they will do as advertised if you let them be!



Just my experience and thoughts....


Anyone feel free to agree/disagree??!!??!!

[fdresq4]

Thank You!
I did use RELOAD on a recent CQUK coating application because
a. The vehicle sits outside.
b. It was sitting outside 24 hours after the application, to help lessen the chances of water spots.

Normally, I like to leave the coating alone and let it do what it's suppose to do. I'm not worried about slickness as much as I am the protection and dirt releasing ability. Better yet, WHY ARE PEOPLE TOUCHING MY VEHICLE??? LOL!

[Corey]

I agree and disagree, (mostly agree). I completely agree about slickness!!!!!!! Why would I be running my fingers on it anyway?

So I don't add anything for the purpose of slickness.

On UK I would add reload if it wasn't going to be able to get a solid cure before seeing water, just to be safe.

Beyond that it's coat, wash regularly with reset and life is good.

Every 3-12 months Iron X and if you want add reload then to smooth any imperfections.

[fdresq4]

I agree and disagree, (mostly agree).
On UK I would add reload if it wasn't going to be able to get a solid cure before seeing water, just to be safe.


Hence why I did the RELOAD on my friend's vehicle which sits outside 24/7. Although it did sit in my garage overnight, I didn't want to chance it.

Steve

[Old Tiger]

I agree with all. In an ideal world, only Reset is needed

[Chris@SEMD]

Me personally still learning the coating in/outs its very unusual not to have the slickness. After using waxes/sealents your whole life/career you learn to gauge how well the protection on the vehicle is by the slickness. For instance, a freshly waxed or sealed car is going to obviously have a nice slick feel to it & that's what most people are expecting. Also that's how most people gauge if they need their car waxed or not. So it's a learning curve or something to get used to. I personally love the feel slick paint, but I have found a new love that is the water beading of a car with a coating. Does Finest have the same feel of CQUK? Also, I recently asked if anyone had experienced a static effect from a coating & was suggested to apply reload to resolve this. Or did I misunderstand?

[Dr Oldz]

I agree and disagree, (mostly agree). I completely agree about slickness!!!!!!! Why would I be running my fingers on it anyway?

So I don't add anything for the purpose of slickness.

On UK I would add reload if it wasn't going to be able to get a solid cure before seeing water, just to be safe.

Beyond that it's coat, wash regularly with reset and life is good.

Every 3-12 months Iron X and if you want add reload then to smooth any imperfections.

I agree Corey. I understand reload in that instance. I consider that not a topping but more as a necessity.

I also prefer TrIx. Tar can really diminish a coating performance also. So i consider Trix the best of both worlds.

[Corey]

I agree Corey. I understand reload in that instance. I consider that not a topping but more as a necessity.

I also prefer TrIx. Tar can really diminish a coating performance also. So i consider Trix the best of both worlds.


Doc, have you tried using Reset as your regular wash on the coating? I find the tar doesn't seem to build up if Reset is used regularly. Curious to see if others have noticed this.

[fdresq4]

I use RESET and I have seen very small amounts of tar. Come to think of it not nearly as much but still a little bit, whether wheels or panels.

[Dr Oldz]

Doc, have you tried using Reset as your regular wash on the coating? I find the tar doesn't seem to build up if Reset is used regularly. Curious to see if others have noticed this.

I haven't used enough to comment but will take note now that you mentioned it.

I have in the past noted that CP coatings tend not to accumulate as much tar build up compared to a standard sealant or wax.

[Rick]

I do like the slick paint and it only matters to me right after application of reload or a rinseless wash. My thinking is if anything can be applied on top of the coating that will make it last a little longer I am all for it. This brings me to another question. How do you know when the coating is reaching the end of its life and what are the first things to look for? My hope would be that the hardness would be the longest lasting ( enter the thats what she said jokes here ).

[Dr_Pain]

WARNING!!!! This post is about to go deep!!

Here are a couple of questions for you:

Have you ever asked yourselves what slickness actually is?
Have you ever asked yourselves what causes slickness?
I do know that you've asked why coatings are not inherently slick, but do you know why they aren't??
Have you ever asked yourselves why we have a love affair with slickness?
Have you ever asked yourselves what slickness actually imparts to your vehicle finish?



Question #1: Have you ever asked yourselves what slickness actually is?


http://classes.midlandstech.edu/carterp/Courses/bio210/chap05/Slide1.JPG

Slickness is a tactile response from the mechanoreceptors we have in our skin. The most sensitive mechanoreceptors are found in the very top layers of the dermis and epidermis and are generally found in larger concentration on the palms, lips, tongue, soles of feet, fingertips, eyelids, and the face. The Merkel's disks and Meissner's corpuscles are the primary mechanoreceptors responsible for translating textures to the brain, whereas Ruffini's corpuscles and Pacinian corpuscles are essential for translating proprioceptive information (3D positional sense)

Question #2: Have you ever asked yourselves what causes slickness?

Obviously since the mechanoreceptor above translate texture, and anything that will impart or reduce the texture will be translated accordingly. Slickeness is the state of reduced/refined texture. So a freshly polished paintwork, devoid of any textural imperfections feels "slick to us". The problem is that we do not really understand the slickness component and often MISUSE the term. Here is a picture I created as "education material" which I will share here but refer to later as well.


https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpa1/t31.0-8/10499486_746096158786094_7066830013593314262_o.jpg

As you can see paint under an electron microscope is ROUGH, but not rough enough that we perceive texture. We will however notice (consciously or unconsciously) the textural difference if imperfections (scratches and swirls or contaminants) are present. By using decontamination agents (mechanical or chemical) we can restore the matrix, by polishing we can refine the matrix, and by protecting we can further refine the textural/tactile feel. So why would a coating not feel "slick"

Question #3: I do know that you've asked why coatings are not inherently slick, but do you know why they aren't??

To answer this question I have to take a step backward and ask a quick question. What is the opposite of slickness? The answer is roughness!!! But is a coating texture rough?? The answer is NO! It is slick but grippy!! I spoke before of the misnomer and misuse of the word "slickness", and this is where we need to do a better job at understanding and translating the information, and what it means. If we look back on the picture I shared you can see that the texture of the outer texture of a wax and sealant (because of their macrostructures) is irregular, whereas the nanostructure of the coating creates a flatter more uniform (self leveling) surface. So what would those differences translate into? As you know, the surface of your palms and fingers are covered with ridges and valleys

http://www.technobuffalo.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/fingerprint-630x420.jpg

As you depress your finger on the surface you will progressively deform those ridges, and as such engage more and more receptors in the analysis of the surface. A very light touch may provide you some information about texture but greater pressure will provide more (until you deform the dermis layer and engage other more important pressure receptors OR if you involve nociceptive (pain) mechanoreceptors). So why aren't coatings inherently slick?? The answer is simpler than you think. The "SUCTION/friction effect"!!. Those finger prints on a "hyper clean" glass like surface, with very minor (imperceptible) deflections will make for a very GRIPPY surface, think along the lines of the old Ajax commercials.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NjQltJjyUU

Unlike coatings, waxes and sealants leave oils behind (natural or petroleum). Those oils are very good in providing a hydrophobic protective layer on the car paint (albeit temporary), but neither offers a hard cured surface self leveled surface which could create this "friction effect". They will never be as "squeaky clean" as an oiless hardened quartz or ceramic surface (oils lubricate).

So in understanding coatings one needs to depart from using slickness as a benchmark descriptor and need to appreciate the "grippiness" of the surface for what it is, and what it means.

Question #4: Have you ever asked yourselves why we have a love affair with slickness?

I won't start psycho-analyzing us to death but you can appreciate that our pleasure centers are definitely positively stimulated by the "lack of texture". We've been programmed since birth!! Just think of how soft and smooth baby blankets are. Just look at the most expensive textiles in the world (from silk to cashmere wool etc...) We are definitely programmed, and wax manufacturer did exploit that in their marketing, equating protection with a smooth and silk "frictionless" surface. Is that the case?? Maybe temporary but you have to stay on top of replacing the "sacrificial barrier" otherwise you are DOOMED!

Question #5: Have you ever asked yourselves what coating slickness actually imparts to your vehicle finish?

Well, lets look at each of the attribute of what coatings actually provide, and understanding what was written above, let's decide if slickness is a product or result of any of those qualities. So here are the attribute sought when applying a coating:


Gloss
Depth of shine
Superhydrophobicity
Scratch resistance
UV resistance
Acid rain and chemical protection
Longevity
Water spotting protection
Contaminant bonding prevention
Self cleaning effect


Everyone knows that NONE of the first 9 relates to the slickness, but most may believe that the 10th does. In fact the slickness MAY help improve the self cleaning effect, but most of that effect comes from the hydrophic qualities of the protection, and coatings offer a SUPERhydrophobic protection over waxes and sealants which offer hydrophobic protection (not super). The "departure angle" and "water surface contact" qualities (for wind resistance) go hands down to the coatings. They are much better than any wax or sealant, and will shed water more readily and more completely despite their grippy nature (not being slick). Don't get me wrong, not all coatings are created equal, but the previous statements does apply to most coatings (some coatings being MUCH better than others).

So the conclusion is that slickness is actually more of an emotional crutch to our upbringing, and a psychological satisfying agent in the likes of chocolate (or anything else that makes your day) If slickness is what you are looking for (in addition to all of the above levels of protections) then just apply Reload once a quarter and smile as you touch the paint :).... (but it is not needed)


https://scontent-dfw.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/t31.0-8/10496922_742665445795832_7586850388562443674_o.jpg

[Smitty]

Excellent and thorough Dr. Pain!

I have tried to explain this to others that comment on the grippy feeling of my vehicle. The first thing I say is, "Hey, stop touching my truck."
I like grippy. It means clean and smooth. Slick has always made me think of lubricity which would make me think of a liquid, semi-liquid or soft state. Translation: dust and dirt attractant. Your post is one of the best written explanations I have seen in a while.

Sent from my phone when I am supposed to be doing something else.

[silverfox]

People love slickness the same way they love foam and suds. The funny thing about both of these love affairs...neither are worthy.

[FSportIS]

WARNING!!!! This post is about to go deep!!

Here are a couple of questions for you:

Have you ever asked yourselves what slickness actually is?
Have you ever asked yourselves what causes slickness?
I do know that you've asked why coatings are not inherently slick, but do you know why they aren't??
Have you ever asked yourselves why we have a love affair with slickness?
Have you ever asked yourselves what slickness actually imparts to your vehicle finish?



Question #1: Have you ever asked yourselves what slickness actually is?


http://classes.midlandstech.edu/carterp/Courses/bio210/chap05/Slide1.JPG

Slickness is a tactile response from the mechanoreceptors we have in our skin. The most sensitive mechanoreceptors are found in the very top layers of the dermis and epidermis and are generally found in larger concentration on the palms, lips, tongue, soles of feet, fingertips, eyelids, and the face. The Merkel's disks and Meissner's corpuscles are the primary mechanoreceptors responsible for translating textures to the brain, whereas Ruffini's corpuscles and Pacinian corpuscles are essential for translating proprioceptive information (3D positional sense)

Question #2: Have you ever asked yourselves what causes slickness?

Obviously since the mechanoreceptor above translate texture, and anything that will impart or reduce the texture will be translated accordingly. Slickeness is the state of reduced/refined texture. So a freshly polished paintwork, devoid of any textural imperfections feels "slick to us". The problem is that we do not really understand the slickness component and often MISUSE the term. Here is a picture I created as "education material" which I will share here but refer to later as well.


https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpa1/t31.0-8/10499486_746096158786094_7066830013593314262_o.jpg

As you can see paint under an electron microscope is ROUGH, but not rough enough that we perceive texture. We will however notice (consciously or unconsciously) the textural difference if imperfections (scratches and swirls or contaminants) are present. By using decontamination agents (mechanical or chemical) we can restore the matrix, by polishing we can refine the matrix, and by protecting we can further refine the textural/tactile feel. So why would a coating not feel "slick"

Question #3: I do know that you've asked why coatings are not inherently slick, but do you know why they aren't??

To answer this question I have to take a step backward and ask a quick question. What is the opposite of slickness? The answer is roughness!!! But is a coating texture rough?? The answer is NO! It is slick but grippy!! I spoke before of the misnomer and misuse of the word "slickness", and this is where we need to do a better job at understanding and translating the information, and what it means. If we look back on the picture I shared you can see that the texture of the outer texture of a wax and sealant (because of their macrostructures) is irregular, whereas the nanostructure of the coating creates a flatter more uniform (self leveling) surface. So what would those differences translate into? As you know, the surface of your palms and fingers are covered with ridges and valleys

http://www.technobuffalo.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/fingerprint-630x420.jpg

As you depress your finger on the surface you will progressively deform those ridges, and as such engage more and more receptors in the analysis of the surface. A very light touch may provide you some information about texture but greater pressure will provide more (until you deform the dermis layer and engage other more important pressure receptors OR if you involve nociceptive (pain) mechanoreceptors). So why aren't coatings inherently slick?? The answer is simpler than you think. The "SUCTION/friction effect"!!. Those finger prints on a "hyper clean" glass like surface, with very minor (imperceptible) deflections will make for a very GRIPPY surface, think along the lines of the old Ajax commercials.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NjQltJjyUU

Unlike coatings, waxes and sealants leave oils behind (natural or petroleum). Those oils are very good in providing a hydrophobic protective layer on the car paint (albeit temporary), but neither offers a hard cured surface self leveled surface which could create this "friction effect". They will never be as "squeaky clean" as an oiless hardened quartz or ceramic surface (oils lubricate).

So in understanding coatings one needs to depart from using slickness as a benchmark descriptor and need to appreciate the "grippiness" of the surface for what it is, and what it means.

Question #4: Have you ever asked yourselves why we have a love affair with slickness?

I won't start psycho-analyzing us to death but you can appreciate that our pleasure centers are definitely positively stimulated by the "lack of texture". We've been programmed since birth!! Just think of how soft and smooth baby blankets are. Just look at the most expensive textiles in the world (from silk to cashmere wool etc...) We are definitely programmed, and wax manufacturer did exploit that in their marketing, equating protection with a smooth and silk "frictionless" surface. Is that the case?? Maybe temporary but you have to stay on top of replacing the "sacrificial barrier" otherwise you are DOOMED!

Question #5: Have you ever asked yourselves what coating slickness actually imparts to your vehicle finish?

Well, lets look at each of the attribute of what coatings actually provide, and understanding what was written above, let's decide if slickness is a product or result of any of those qualities. So here are the attribute sought when applying a coating:


Gloss
Depth of shine
Superhydrophobicity
Scratch resistance
UV resistance
Acid rain and chemical protection
Longevity
Water spotting protection
Contaminant bonding prevention
Self cleaning effect


Everyone knows that NONE of the first 9 relates to the slickness, but most may believe that the 10th does. In fact the slickness MAY help improve the self cleaning effect, but most of that effect comes from the hydrophic qualities of the protection, and coatings offer a SUPERhydrophobic protection over waxes and sealants which offer hydrophobic protection (not super). The "departure angle" and "water surface contact" qualities (for wind resistance) go hands down to the coatings. They are much better than any wax or sealant, and will shed water more readily and more completely despite their grippy nature (not being slick). Don't get me wrong, not all coatings are created equal, but the previous statements does apply to most coatings (some coatings being MUCH better than others).

So the conclusion is that slickness is actually more of an emotional crutch to our upbringing, and a psychological satisfying agent in the likes of chocolate (or anything else that makes your day) If slickness is what you are looking for (in addition to all of the above levels of protections) then just apply Reload once a quarter and smile as you touch the paint :).... (but it is not needed)


https://scontent-dfw.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/t31.0-8/10496922_742665445795832_7586850388562443674_o.jpg

Truth! You really stand for your name! You are definitely a DOCTOR--Detailing Doctor! Thank you for this great post, I learn a lot from it. :)

[silverfox]

What's even more amazing is guys topping a coating (thereby negating its characteristics) just to add slickness. Why? Who the heck touches the paint other than the owner? Seriously....

[Chris@SEMD]

Thanks for writing another great article. I have learned a lot from this & really appreciate you taking the time to help teach everyone. My skills as a detailer have dramatically improved from becoming a member of this forum & learning to use all of the CarPro & MFM products & thanks to guys like you who are willing to share information to better everyone willing to learn. Thx again, keep up the good work!!

[TroyScherer]

Hmm.... This is interesting. And I do agree.

But it now makes me question the use or Reload on CQ even though it is suggested. Can anyone provide a little feedback on this?

[silverfox]

I get the idea of topping CQ with Reload before CQ fully cures if the car is exposed to moisture soon after its coated...but applying Reload as a regular maintenance topping for CQ, or just to make the coating slicker...is really questionable. Nothing is going to protect a coating other than another coating...sure as heck a sealant or wax can't. Its just another unnecessary step and expense.

[Corey]

Extremely interesting writeup Doctor!!

[Corey]

Let me play devils advocate for using Reload over time (not as an anti water spot topper at application). I won't touch on its slickness as that isn't something I care much about. I will of course admit that when speaking to a customer I freely share with them the slickness attribute as they do seem to care in spite of my explanation of its unimportance. I'll send them to the Doctors article next time. "Misunderstood" is much better stated than "unimportant"

Anyway to the subject...

Reload is a water based product that contains both anti acid components (protect from hard water during curing), and some Sio2 (Quartz like cQuartz)

Reload is almost like a hybrid coating "Lite"

You could argue it's use going forward is to keep the surface smooth reducing the friction and upholding the sliding angle.

Over time break dust and all manner of particles can affect the uppermost surface of any coating on the market, specifically if not washed regularly with the correct maintenance cleaners (Reset and Iron X specifically)

Anywho, over time tiny microscopic irregularities or voids can occur on that surface, (not necessarily visible defects - but theoretically it makes sense microscopic defects would come into existence over time) whether it be from where an iron deposit existed before the use of iron X or be it some type of matter that was allowed to rot and oxidize without the owner caring to wash it for a few weeks.

Now imagine a drop of water sliding across the surface. Any microscopic cavity or irregularity on the surface is going to either push or pull on that water as it slides, ultimately slowing its exit from the paint.

Enter Reload - Reload is capable of filling voids in the coating with Sio2 and of course "other stuff" ;)

Simply put (maybe even an oversimplification and not quite the full story) I suppose you could say Reset, Spotless, and Iron X solve imperfections that protrude above the surface while Reload solves imperfections (microscopic voids) in the surface itself.

Rewind.... An important note to also make is the importance of Reload to protect coatings from hard water spots. Most coatings have a weakness when it comes to water spots even after they are cured. CQuartz coatings are actually very strong in this department. Finest actually has zero need for Reload even at time of application. While CQuartz UK is very strong in the water spot resistance department, it is not so at first.

Because of how each of us here reading this cares for their vehicle it's probably safe to say we wouldn't have an issue with water spots even without Reload but for many out there having it applied they need it.

[Dr_Pain]

Excellent and thorough Dr. Pain!

I have tried to explain this to others that comment on the grippy feeling of my vehicle. The first thing I say is, "Hey, stop touching my truck."
I like grippy. It means clean and smooth. Slick has always made me think of lubricity which would make me think of a liquid, semi-liquid or soft state. Translation: dust and dirt attractant. Your post is one of the best written explanations I have seen in a while.

Sent from my phone when I am supposed to be doing something else.

Completely agree! Someone noticing slickness is touching the paintwork way too much LOL!


People love slickness the same way they love foam and suds. The funny thing about both of these love affairs...neither are worthy.

I could not agree more! If we were about "smoke and mirrors" then we could light coatings on fire, strike them with soft plastic object, impress customers with foam shows and make them touch hyper lubricated surface making them believe that nothing will stick.... BUT we are not! The truth always comes out and the truth as you expressed is gospel. The cleansing power of a soap is not proportional to how much foam or suds it provides, the alkaline surfactants which breakdown the organic and inorganic "slim" does and if I am not mistaken Lye (pH 13) does not foam ;)


Truth! You really stand for your name! You are definitely a DOCTOR--Detailing Doctor! Thank you for this great post, I learn a lot from it. :)

Sometimes I get inspired LOL! Thanks for the comment!


What's even more amazing is guys topping a coating (thereby negating its characteristics) just to add slickness. Why? Who the heck touches the paint other than the owner? Seriously....

Another great comment! The cost benefit do need to be investigated to see if we are truly negating the characteristics or muting them by adding slickness or enhancing (I think the Jury is split on this one)


Thanks for writing another great article. I have learned a lot from this & really appreciate you taking the time to help teach everyone. My skills as a detailer have dramatically improved from becoming a member of this forum & learning to use all of the CarPro & MFM products & thanks to guys like you who are willing to share information to better everyone willing to learn. Thx again, keep up the good work!!

Chris, your comment made me smile (a smile of contentment). Sometime our schedule get overwhelming and it is hard to find the time to add more hours to our day but comments like this makes it all worthwhile. Looking forward to your contributions :)



Hmm.... This is interesting. And I do agree.

But it now makes me question the use or Reload on CQ even though it is suggested. Can anyone provide a little feedback on this?



Great question Troy, and I will expand on my thoughts and theories in the next reply


I get the idea of topping CQ with Reload before CQ fully cures if the car is exposed to moisture soon after its coated...but applying Reload as a regular maintenance topping for CQ, or just to make the coating slicker...is really questionable. Nothing is going to protect a coating other than another coating...sure as heck a sealant or wax can't. Its just another unnecessary step and expense.

This is definitely part of the cost benefit analysis which can be debated Ad Nauseum! The truth is we will never know 100%. As stated above, I can only offer some "theoretical reasoning" which each of us need verify for ourselves.


Extremely interesting writeup Doctor!!


Let me play devils advocate for using Reload over time (not as an anti water spot topper at application). I won't touch on its slickness as that isn't something I care much about. I will of course admit that when speaking to a customer I freely share with them the slickness attribute as they do seem to care in spite of my explanation of its unimportance. I'll send them to the Doctors article next time. "Misunderstood" is much better stated than "unimportant"

Anyway to the subject...

Reload is a water based product that contains both anti acid components (protect from hard water during curing), and some Sio2 (Quartz like cQuartz)

Reload is almost like a hybrid coating "Lite"

You could argue it's use going forward is to keep the surface smooth reducing the friction and upholding the sliding angle.

Over time break dust and all manner of particles can affect the uppermost surface of any coating on the market, specifically if not washed regularly with the correct maintenance cleaners (Reset and Iron X specifically)

Anywho, over time tiny microscopic irregularities or voids can occur on that surface, (not necessarily visible defects - but theoretically it makes sense microscopic defects would come into existence over time) whether it be from where an iron deposit existed before the use of iron X or be it some type of matter that was allowed to rot and oxidize without the owner caring to wash it for a few weeks.

Now imagine a drop of water sliding across the surface. Any microscopic cavity or irregularity on the surface is going to either push or pull on that water as it slides, ultimately slowing its exit from the paint.

Enter Reload - Reload is capable of filling voids in the coating with Sio2 and of course "other stuff" ;)

Simply put (maybe even an oversimplification and not quite the full story) I suppose you could say Reset, Spotless, and Iron X solve imperfections that protrude above the surface while Reload solves imperfections (microscopic voids) in the surface itself.

Rewind.... An important note to also make is the importance of Reload to protect coatings from hard water spots. Most coatings have a weakness when it comes to water spots even after they are cured. CQuartz coatings are actually very strong in this department. Finest actually has zero need for Reload even at time of application. While CQuartz UK is very strong in the water spot resistance department, it is not so at first.

Because of how each of us here reading this cares for their vehicle it's probably safe to say we wouldn't have an issue with water spots even without Reload but for many out there having it applied they need it.

Thanks for the reply Corey! Let me take this reply and add some on my 2 cents to the equation (in the next reply!)

[FSportIS]

Let me play devils advocate for using Reload over time (not as an anti water spot topper at application). I won't touch on its slickness as that isn't something I care much about. I will of course admit that when speaking to a customer I freely share with them the slickness attribute as they do seem to care in spite of my explanation of its unimportance. I'll send them to the Doctors article next time. "Misunderstood" is much better stated than "unimportant"

Anyway to the subject...

Reload is a water based product that contains both anti acid components (protect from hard water during curing), and some Sio2 (Quartz like cQuartz)

Reload is almost like a hybrid coating "Lite"

You could argue it's use going forward is to keep the surface smooth reducing the friction and upholding the sliding angle.

Over time break dust and all manner of particles can affect the uppermost surface of any coating on the market, specifically if not washed regularly with the correct maintenance cleaners (Reset and Iron X specifically)

Anywho, over time tiny microscopic irregularities or voids can occur on that surface, (not necessarily visible defects - but theoretically it makes sense microscopic defects would come into existence over time) whether it be from where an iron deposit existed before the use of iron X or be it some type of matter that was allowed to rot and oxidize without the owner caring to wash it for a few weeks.

Now imagine a drop of water sliding across the surface. Any microscopic cavity or irregularity on the surface is going to either push or pull on that water as it slides, ultimately slowing its exit from the paint.

Enter Reload - Reload is capable of filling voids in the coating with Sio2 and of course "other stuff" ;)

Simply put (maybe even an oversimplification and not quite the full story) I suppose you could say Reset, Spotless, and Iron X solve imperfections that protrude above the surface while Reload solves imperfections (microscopic voids) in the surface itself.

Rewind.... An important note to also make is the importance of Reload to protect coatings from hard water spots. Most coatings have a weakness when it comes to water spots even after they are cured. CQuartz coatings are actually very strong in this department. Finest actually has zero need for Reload even at time of application. While CQuartz UK is very strong in the water spot resistance department, it is not so at first.

Because of how each of us here reading this cares for their vehicle it's probably safe to say we wouldn't have an issue with water spots even without Reload but for many out there having it applied they need it.

Wow, another insightful post!

I would like to add something to the mix.

We have to distinguish two types of "slickness" that seems to be mixed up:
Type 1: Paint without contamination vs. paint with contamination. This is when people use the baggy test or hands to touch to see bumps on paint. If there are little to no bump, that means the contamination are either trimmed off by clay bar or removed by Iron X. This smoothness is sometimes confused with slickness.

Type 2: The slippery feel of the hands on paint. With certain sealants such as Reload, touching the paint feels like there is some lubrication on the paint.

Anyways, I believe Dr_Pain is referring to slickness type 2 which is not so important which I agree. Slickness type 1, on the opposite side, is IMPORTANT because contamination will hurt beading/sheeting property. Similarly, irregularities/voids does too just like Corey mentioned.

You point out that overtime, there are microscopic voids because of brake dust or other sharp iron particles. Now, that in a way is similar to minor marring except that the voids would probably have random pattern. It is like the paint being hit by bunch of tiny little nails everywhere. Reload is beneficial by filling in these voids. However, Reload's slickness property is not really contributing to this filing effect. I mean, I could have used something else like wax or glaze to fill in as well. My point is filling in property is independent of slickness type 2.

[Corey]

Ya, agreed! [emoji2] slickness of reload is beside the point to me but rather the smoothness it creates.

A glaze or wax won't do what reload will as it will wash off immediately and of course let dust and dirt stick to it.

[Dr_Pain]

@FSportIS I do appreciate your differentiation and totally agree!.... but for the sake of clarification I would go with different terminology (as Corey pointed out).

[Dr_Pain]

So here is what I've seen discussed in the ever question of using Reload over a coating!

1) Using Reload over a fresh coating allows temporary protection while the coating is curing (which can take 30+ days for full cure, and full benefits)
2) Using Reload over an established coating for slickness (pure tactile pleasure and a psychological pacifier)
3) Using Reload over an established coating to fill in some micro marring (as discussed by FSportIS, and documented)<--- and yes it does have some filling capabilities!!
4) (My favorite) Using Reload (SiO2) to chemically react with the free chemical bonds of the outer layer of the coating matrix.

>> Let me explain my theories on this.... and they are just theories because I am not privileged to the science of CQuartz<<


http://blog.nus.edu.sg/kyawthetlatt/files/2013/08/image2-1qaf3mb.png
http://media-2.web.britannica.com/eb-media/19/2619-004-0710A65B.jpg

The chemical reaction which creates the nano-matrix of the CQuartz coating produces a SiO2 tetrahydral structure which interlock with other units (from what I read) which creates a stable structure. Although it is stable, and technically could last forever (in a perfect environment), we all know that the coatings will be subjected to "exposure" (chemical and mechanical), which will disrupt the outer "exposed" layer of the matrix. Picture a cured coating as a freshly woven "unworn" cotton t-shirt, where each strand is perfect (or as perfect as it can be). None of those strands (which would represent chemical bonds) are "available" to bond with other "things".


http://images.fineartamerica.com/images-medium-large/5-sem-fastskin-fabric-ted-kinsman.jpg

Now imagine the same fabric after MANY washes!!


http://tn.new.fishki.net/26/upload/post/201409/26/1308708/1_024fc542507661af5d-45023312.jpg

As you can see, a lot of microscopic fibers are now "available" for bonding <--- and velcro love those :). Chemical bonds behave the same. The stable coating matrix will eventually suffer the same fate as the cotton matrix, and it too will be disrupted (through chemical and mechanical exposure) making ionically charged bonds available for reaction with other chemical reagents. The laws of chemistry are pretty simple. Chemicals are looking for stability and therefore will react with any available reagents to achieve a stable component (unless they are inert). The point of this post is: IF my theories are correct, that free endings of the SiO2 chemical matrix are available for bonding...... so why not provide it with a chemical component (Reload with SiO2) which would restore the properties and function of the original matrix, rather than letting nature decide what chemicals it will be exposed to, and react with.

The more I research coatings, and the more I dive into the chemistry that seems to be applied to them, the more I am convinced that simple maintenance and simple preventative measures can and will make the perceived viability of the coating much longer than what the manufacturer claim they are good for. I think they place a 2 year life expectancy on the fact that a daily driver will be exposed to so many things that our desire for "perfection" won't allow us not to refresh it. Although the hydrophobic qualities may not be the same as day one, the protection provided may be exactly the same!? but the fact that we have "love marks" (handling scuffs and wash swirls etc..) will prompt us to re-polish and recoat!!

I used the words "perceived viability" because we currently do not have specific tests to let us know if a coating a present or gone. We solely depend on the expected qualities (ie. gloss, hydrophobicity, and texture) which neither fully confirm the presence or absence of the coating. We may still have a functioning protection on the car but believe it is gone and in need to be replaced when in fact it may still be present, and still protecting against water spotting, UV fading etc...

[FSportIS]

Wow Doctor Pain, not only do you articulate extremely well but also possess a paramount of chemistry knowledge in coating technology. I always learn a lot by reading your posts on this forum. May I ask are you a chemical engineer or detailer or both?? You really write like my engineering professors in some way lol.

You have just convinced me to top Reload on my CQUK coating every 3 months or so to bond with the "available" microscopic fibers to prevent ionically charged bonds available for reaction with other chemical reagents.

In a more mundane term, I see several benefits of Reload on top of coating:
1. Temporarily protect the coating from water spot during curing process. (From Carpro people)
2. Fill in the voids to have "smoothness" which maintain the crazy beading/sheeting property. (From Corey)
3. To maintain the strength and integrity of the microscopic bonds so that it prevents slow and steady disruption by contamination over time. (From our famous Doctor Pain) (re-worded by my understanding)
4. To max out shine/gloss and slickness feeling. (Me plus many others)
5. To have a reason to continue emptying our pocket buying Reload :D jokking!!!

I have some follow up questions:
1. Carpro makes 2 year protection claim on Cquartz coating. Is this assuming the car is readily exposed to natural environment contaminations such as the daily driver? Is it also assuming no Reload on top?

2. If we Reload every 3 months with weekly wash with Reset by someone who really cares about their cars, how long should Cquartz coating last? I want a realistic and specific answer, and not "depend" or "should be more than 2 years" type of answer here.

[Dr_Pain]

Wow Doctor Pain, not only do you articulate extremely well but also possess a paramount of chemistry knowledge in coating technology. I always learn a lot by reading your posts on this forum. May I ask are you a chemical engineer or detailer or both?? You really write like my engineering professors in some way lol.

You have just convinced me to top Reload on my CQUK coating every 3 months or so to bond with the "available" microscopic fibers to prevent ionically charged bonds available for reaction with other chemical reagents.

In a more mundane term, I see several benefits of Reload on top of coating:
1. Temporarily protect the coating from water spot during curing process. (From Carpro people)
2. Fill in the voids to have "smoothness" which maintain the crazy beading/sheeting property. (From Corey)
3. To maintain the strength and integrity of the microscopic bonds so that it prevents slow and steady disruption by contamination over time. (From our famous Doctor Pain) (re-worded by my understanding)
4. To max out shine/gloss and slickness feeling. (Me plus many others)
5. To have a reason to continue emptying our pocket buying Reload :D jokking!!!

I have some follow up questions:
1. Carpro makes 2 year protection claim on Cquartz coating. Is this assuming the car is readily exposed to natural environment contaminations such as the daily driver? Is it also assuming no Reload on top?

2. If we Reload every 3 months with weekly wash with Reset by someone who really cares about their cars, how long should Cquartz coating last? I want a realistic and specific answer, and not "depend" or "should be more than 2 years" type of answer here.

You actually made me laugh out loud in my office. I think my staff think I'm losing it ;)

Let me say thank you for the accolade. I'm glad you feel you are benefiting from my posts. My education background is as follow: science diploma, major in biochemistry, Bachelors and Doctorate in Physical Therapy with a sub-specialty in orthopedic manual therapy, therefore nothing that puts me as the ultimate authority in coating chemistry. BTW, English is my second language ;) I do have an extensive background in chemistry which I try to use in extrapolating and interpolating coating technologies, however there is a LOT that I don't know. Although I am a great student and wish to know more, it seems that all manufacturer keep the fine details close to the vest (and you would be surprised how many don't know a single thing about the technology, and leave the nitty gritty to the chemists). I've been detailing since College and decided to turn a weekend obsession into a business almost 3 years ago.

I do love your summarized key point!

As to your follow up question...... The protection claim is just an approximate life expectancy on coated daily driver (no reload, just regular maintenance with automotive safe chemicals). Technically subjected to the least amount of "exposure" the quartz matrix will last indefinitely but we all know that something will come to make us want to revive what once was! It is impossible to wash or handle the paintwork without leaving those "love marks", so eventually those imperfections will reach critical mass, same with the loss of gloss, or the lack lustered beading. I've had a coating on my DD (Black Ford Raptor) for 2 years and it is still going strong. I want to redo it and use a Pro Coating but have yet to be so disgusted to warrant the 16 hrs of work I would have to put into redoing it. Essentially the cost/benefit ratio is not there yet. I do get tempted, especially when I park next to my son's Jeep (which is triple coated with CQuartz Finest) or when I see the incredible beading, but all technical characteristics of the consumer grade coating on my DD tells me that it is still doing what it was intended to do, and my truck still looks better than 99% of the DD on the road right now.

A realistic answer to the CQuartz life expectancy is not available because it hasn't been around long enough. Before CQuartz came AQuartz, and even CQuartz has seen many evolutions through its life. The CQuartz of today is not the same formulation than its original self, so a test subject showing results could only speak of an outdated technology. CQuartz Finest (which is the Pro coating) is now on V6 which was completely reformulated and re-engineered this past year. So even if I were to try and give you an ACCURATE answer on Finest I could not, since the newer technology does not compare to the old. According to the chemists and the manufacturer it is more scratch resistant, more resistant to water spotting and having installed V4, V5, V6 I can vouch that V6 is much glossier and provides deeper depth of color than its predecessor...... which just confirms to me that V6 is definitely an improvement from V4 and V5 which both were similar with some application characteristic differences.

Personally, I believe that you will get tired of the fading gloss way before the coating has failed (same as what I am facing right now). The micro marring and minor scuffs and swirls are so obvious to my eye that it is inching me closer to redoing my truck DESPITE the fact that it still beads just like this, and looks like this (even under my Flex inspection light):

http://carproforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=235&d=1415630659

http://carproforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=252&d=1415631399

http://carproforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=254&d=1415631436

[FSportIS]

Doctor, your truck look fantastic in the picture. I scrutinize the pictures multiple times and it looks flawless to me. The beading is great. I don't even see a single minor marring under LED light. The last picture has great reflection. It is really oh my gloss! I'm very OCD myself about paint condition but doctor, you bring that OCDness onto a heavenly level. Haha, Doctor, you should come back to the real world and accept few minor imperfections because we can't have 100% perfection at the microscopic level.

How old is the CQUK on this truck now? When was the last time you polish this car? I can tell you baby this truck during all these times. Good work Doctor Pain. I think you should be Doctor PainT!

A bit off topic here, you have Phd in therapy. Is this some type of medical major? Is it like physical therapy? And... how does your research and major related to car detailing?? I'm quite surprised to see a PhD medical professional working as a detailer lol.

[Dr_Pain]

There are a few minor imperfections but you need to be in the right light at the right angle to see it... but depth of color and gloss factor difference are definitely more obvious when you have a better comparison on the side.

The consumer grade coating is about 2 years old and the truck was polished before applying the coating. Nothing has been done to the truck except for IronX and regular washes. You can feel some bonded contaminants but minor (for being 2 years without claying). The truck is a daily driven truck, garage kept at night only, so all day in the Southern exposure of sugar cane country (with industrial pesticides, herbicides, and oil field related industrial fall outs). Doctor Paint I am not. I do posses some skills but nothing compare to some of my fellow "brothers".

My degree is not a medical major, since physical therapy school is no longer governed by the AMA and that the program is free standing. Actually to be technical, physical therapy was a specialization of nursing before it gained momentum as its own clinical specialty. The specialization took root during the Civil War when nurses were assigned to rehabilitate injured soldiers back to the front line. It further expanded during the early 20th century with the polio epidemic.... but I digress. My doctorate is a clinical specialization in the field of physical therapy, so advanced knowledge, research etc... Don't be surprised to see a white collar professional in the field of detailing. It is not as uncommon as you may think. I've met plenty attorneys, doctors etc... doing this kind of work. It does break the monotony, and in my case helps "center" me, and feeds the instant gratification which is rarely seen in any clinical practice. Most "successes" we see in our practice field happen over MONTHS, when you can turn and burn a car in one weekend. My educational background does help be more focused and organized, since I was "drilled and grilled" in the scientific methodology. All those clinical algorithm processes are the same, and my research background helps me to develop a more critical eye for the shananigans of "snake oil vendors".

[fdresq4]

Knocking out of the park once again Claude! I like Reload as a stand alone for our old CR-V.

Steve