The term paint correction. I think i am in the right place now

[autoemp]

The term paint correction?
Here comes one of a couple of questions that I have. I guess you can call this and the other questions that I have a bitch session Q&A. I will start a new post for each question. I am open to constructive criticism, but don't be too mean though. I thought what better platform to ask these questions, but to ask fellow professionals and DIY detail enthusiasts.

Is it me or is the term paint correction becoming to loosely used in the industry? I see a lot of "Detailers" using the term on craigslist and instagram. Their claiming to do a 3 step paint correction in 3 to 4 hours or they are on their 4th vehicle of the day. As far as I can tell there is only 1 or 2 people working on the car and only charging about $250-$300 on average. The only way I see a full correction being done that fast is if you have a team of people on that car. I see problems with both scenarios. "Correction" work that fast I see as a basic polish or an extensive one for that matter but not true correction. to bring SOME shine back and in the process remove some swirls and scratches claiming that correction has been done.

As for my self depending on the level of correction needed it takes at least a full 10 to 12 hours to do a "basic" correction or can go to the 3,4,5 day time frame if you have all the tools. Or am I just terribly slow.

Please correct me if I'm wrong.

robert

[EVOlved]

Robert,

I believe people who want to make themselves feel good and look professional use the term a lot. So yes it is used loosely by lots of folk.

10 to 12 hours for a "basic" correction does seem a bit long toothed but I don't know what process you are speaking of? If you are referring to a 2 step with a sealant or coating application sounds about right. Or a one step with sealant app and full interior sure.

[DARK HORSE]

As for my self depending on the level of correction needed it takes at least a full 10 to 12 hours to do a "basic" correction or can go to the 3,4,5 day time frame if you have all the tools. Or am I just terribly slow.

Please correct me if I'm wrong.

robert

Robert, IMHO you are exactly right. It doesn't sound to me like you are slow, it sounds to me like you are probably thorough and take pride in doing a great job you can be proud of, amen brother! This is NOT to say others that are faster than us aren't also doing a great job and taking pride in their work, as I am sure many are. I know of some awesome detailers who are definitely faster than me. I am also sure there are hacks out there as well, not necessarily doing what I would consider "stellar" work. The amount of time it takes you is right on par with the amount of time I spend doing correction and restoration work. Hell, I spend about 3 hours just coating/leveling a vehicle after correction, but I charge accordingly for said time :D Corey and I working together one time spent 9 (12+ hour) days working (very hard) on just two vehicles. Do the math there.

[ChrisDA]

You're not slow at all Robert, you are right on track with the time it takes me to do correction work. I like to do the job properly and unfortunately some people don't understand how long it actually takes to do that.

[Detail2Correction]

Robert,

Glad to see you posting here. I don't think you are slow at all. I would venture to guess your "basic" correction is much better than others "3 or 4 step corrections" Depending on the size and condition of the vehicle I'm doing; a prewash, wash and a two step decon, can take 3 or more hours. I consider myself on the slow side but much better than I use to be. When I started learning about paint correction/professional detailing I had no idea it would take me to where I am now. I first wanted to learn the right way to do things. After that I'm working on being more time efficient.

Depending on if you are a weekend warrior or do this to make a living has a lot to do with it to. Doing more work or extra work that you aren't getting paid to do is one of the biggest reasons people don't make it in this industry. "You can be the best detailer in the world but it doesn't mean you will be profitable doing it if you don't know how to operate a business". Scotty from Scotty's Shine Shop said that on a podcast I listened to from AMMO NYC earlier this year. That one sentence has had a huge impact on me. Almost life changing.

Do the work the customer wants and price accordingly. For some reason detailers will work for less money than they would for someone else. What I mean is if you are doing paint correction to support yourself and your family. Look at exactly how much you are making at the end of a job. Time, expenses, products, sweat equity, etc. After you figure that up ask yourself would you work for someone else making that much money.

If you are doing paint correction as a way to get extra money on the side it's not as important but it still is.

Going back to doing exactly what the customer is paying you to do. It's also your job to be able to communicate to the customer what each package that you offer will give them. Personally I don't like using one step, two step, etc. The reason being is lets say you charge $500 for a one step(a killer knock it out of the park one step) and Joe Blow down the street who has watched a bunch of You Tube videos offers a three step for $400, more than likely the customer will go with Joe Blow because 1. It's a little cheaper 2. In their mind they are going to get better results because it's a 3 step, even though that's probably not the case.

Doing what I call, "high end" or "professional" grade detailing is for a small group of people. Most people want clean and shiny. I can not bring myself to do clean and shiny, that's why I do this as a side business. People are cheap. If you are doing this to make a living you have to keep that in mind and provide services that will make the customer happy and most of all make you profitable.

Most people and when I say most I mean just about everyone, does not look at paint like I do, like Corey does, ChrisDA does and I'm guessing like you do. My point is when you are doing all that extra work that you are not getting paid for; not only are you not getting paid for it's not going to be noticed or appreciated. So why do it? There are two answers to this IMO. 1. I do it because I want everything I do to be as good as it can be. 2.(from a business perspective)You shouldn't do it.

Please don't think I'm advocating screwing people over. That's far from it. What I'm trying to prevent is YOU getting screwed over. Learn how to explain what you do effectively and then perform that task.

I have no idea how I went off on this tangent but hopefully SOME of it can be useful to someone.

[Dr_Pain]

Unfortunately there are no TM in the industry and no words are protected under law within the industry, so anyone can use whatever terminology to describe whatever they want. It is a great marketing tool to the unsuspected consumer. To use a term they are loosely familiar which is used to describe a process (which by any standard would never be use with their level of hack), is hack marketing 101!. Those unscrupulous characters use those terms in hopes to "defraud". They flood the market with your deceptive advertising, do as many jobs as you can before being discovered, pocket the money and move on to the next venture, under a different assumed name.

I would love to solely blame the pseudo-detailer, however the blame sit squarely on the consumer (being too lazy to do their due diligence). How many times do we hear: "If it sounds too good to be true, then it is!!", "You get what you pay for!", etc.... ??? Those unscrupulous characters don't force you to hand the keys over, but they do convince the weak or uneducated individuals with their song and dance. Do yourself a favor and educate yourself, first to know what you pay for, and second to understand the difference between a knowledgeable detailer and a detailer wannabe.

As far as how many hours you take to do a 1 step...... IMHO you are in the right ballpark for a 80%+ correction level. You can do a basic outside AIO with less than 20% correction in about 4 hrs with no greater decon then a quick clay, but ask me how many AIO I do!?! Being that my customers are my priority, I will advise to save with a filler sealant until they are ready to do it right. They have full disclosures at my shop (sometimes to a fault), but that is why I have such loyal customers ;).

[Detail2Correction]

Good post Dr. Pain

[EVOlved]

Being that my customers are my priority, I will advise to save with a filler sealant until they are ready to do it right. They have full disclosures at my shop (sometimes to a fault), but that is why I have such loyal customers ;).

You have left me intrigued a filler sealant? What would you be referring to?? Only thing that comes to my mind is Hydr02 since it does seem to mask some stuff.

[Dr_Pain]

You have left me intrigued a filler sealant? What would you be referring to?? Only thing that comes to my mind is Hydr02 since it does seem to mask some stuff.

What I am referring to is a sealant or glaze that contains fillers, which will essentially (and temporarily) fill the minor defects. If you want to be purely technical about it, any wax or paint sealant leaves a residual amount of product to protect the paint. This will find its way into all those minor imperfections and will fill them(to some degree). As it cures, the product will bond and harden in the imperfection. As you gently remove the haze (once cured) you will gently remove (level) the top most layer, leaving behind a slightly filled crevasse. Some products are better than other at bonding and will stay in those imperfections longer, however eventually they will be washed away revealing those minor imperfections once again. One product in my arsenal that seems to be doing a fair job at filling (although it is toted as having no "filler") is CG Blacklight. It does not last long but will make micro marring, and the tiny wash swirls disappear.

[Mike lambert]

We do only full corrections,the only choice is a sealant or finest. Depending on the car that may take 6 to 12 hours. That is polishing,not washing or decon.i average 4/5 coatings a week,the more we do the more other people want it. We also safely and responsibly correct paint,meaning there will be defects that cannot be safely removed.that is removing up to .5 mils of paint,as recommended by the paint manufacturers. To attempt to remove all defects no matter what is in my opinion irresponsible.

[EVOlved]

Thanks for the very thorough response Dr. Pain. I was just trying to come up with what product you were referring to because it sounded like a glaze sealant which I had never heard of.