Dr_Pain
Certified Finest Installer
Well, let me be the first to say how excited I am about this new product. I was selected to be a BETA tester for Forte due to my geographical location. South Louisiana is known for its heat and humidity and as such offered a good "torture test" to evaluate its application, performance and durability. I do want to thank Avi and Corey for trusting me with this rather important task.
FlyBy Forte is NOT a reformulation of FlyBy30 but a whole new design. So Let's introduce CarPro FlyBy Forte
The following was shared in confidence, but I now have the permission to share with my fellow detailers. (This is literally a cut and paste!)
"FlyBy Forte is a brand new technologically advanced windshield coating. Development of Flyby Forte was heavily based on the latest and most advanced mobile phone anti-scratch protection. Our inorganic Nano-tech coating was specifically designed for EXTREME semi-permanent durability and long-term resistance to abrasion and chemicals.
Flyby Forte was tested to over 40,000 real time wiper cleaning cycles, is UV stable, highly chemical resistant, and provides resistance to scratches and minor chips. Flyby Forte is the ULTIMATE in windshield and glass coatings! Unlike traditional glass coatings, which attach to the surface, Forte fully bonds by penetrating the top surface of glass, merging and transforming it into a hydrophobic smooth surface. Flyby Forte does not allow chattering, wiper noise, or degradation of the glass. Rain droplets slide off fast at speeds beyond 50kmh for a minimum of 6 months. Expected durability is up to 2 years."
FlyBy Forte:
Specifications:(from CarPro-US)
• Initial contact Angle (DIN EN 828) : 115 Degrees
• Water drop sliding angle: <20 deg.
• Extreme abrasion resistance
• No wiper chatter
• Repels water, dirt, dust, salt, ice, and snow
• Easy to apply
• Long lasting durable protection
• Harsh chemicals resistant (from 4~12 pH)
• Improves night vision
• Suitable for any glass type: Auto, Marine, Aviation, and more"
Precautions
•Wear gloves
•Note: Avoid applying over rubber trim or to the paint. If product contacts paint or rubber wipe off with wet MF towel immediately.
Directions
•Polish the glass
•Clean surface free of polishing oil residue with CarPro Eraser
•Pour a few drops over the supplied cotton pad
•Apply in circular motion in an organized pattern across the glass and do not wipe off. It will flash nearly invisible as you apply.
•On windshield: Repeat steps 3 and 4 (2 more times - 3 coats total) / On side windows skip this and move to next step
•Using the same applicator (but no additional Forte) once again repeat step 4 buffing off any trace of residue until the surface is 100% transparent and clear.
•After entire windshield is coated, apply Flyby Forte to the Wiper blades and leave wipers off of the glass for at least 10 minutes.
•For side windows only 1 layer is needed.
•Keep surface dry for 4 hours with no wiper blades for 24 hours.
Here is how the product was installed (with pictures to boot)
This is a before picture!
With directions from Corey @ CarPro-US I decided to do a 50/50 split window comparison Forte vs. uncoated
The following are the exact steps I took (after properly cleaning and claying the glass):
Simple right???
I did capture a picture of the product as it was flashing, but in order to do so I had to apply "liberally" (overapply)
Under normal condition, you may see a very faint ghosting
IMPRESSION: This product is RIDICULOUSLY simple and truly fool proof. I was actually frustrated not to be able to see where I had been (since it flashes clear), but the results are stunning. Temperature on that day was 88 degrees with 51% humidity. According to what I've read it makes little to no differences, since it is a wipe on/wipe off. It was great not to have to heat cure. I used more product then needed because I felt I was not using enough (something I had a hard time convincing myself otherwise, even though I knew better). I believe this will be a common mistake and may result in product waste, and end-user frustrations. I personally did NOT like the supplied cotton applicator as they started to delaminate. I suggested to Corey to recommend CarPro include square cotton makeup pads (like the ones my wife uses to remove her makeup). Although I did place a tape line, and applied liberally to and on the tape line, it did not create a product line.... at all!! WOOHOO! I was concerned about getting a product line in my line of sight but coated and uncoated look exactly the same with no visual transitions. So there is no DIY fear that you may end up with a high spot in your field of vision.
Total Time: tape, prep, polish and picture documentation took me a little over 1h30 (because I was taking my time and kept missing the "perfect picture").
WHAT I FOUND: I found that working in total darkness with a single light LED panel was the best. I also found that final inspection was best done with a hand held light source (like my Flex light). I did bring the car out in the sun, but was blinded so inspection was not the best in full sun, however in early light (the next day) I was able to see some area where I missed wiping the product. It came off no problem (interesting!).
Personal recommendationThe alcohol carrier is a little strong, but not strong enough to wear PPE. For good measure I did keep the wiper blades off the glass overnight, and did not use them for >24hrs as recommended. According to the manufacturer, the product should be safe to get wet in as a little as 4 hrs however I personally won't take a chance until we have more testing. I will most likely make the same recommendation as with any other coatings to wait 12 hrs before getting wet. Hopefully with more testing we will be able to confirm the 4hr safe zone.
If this product produces on its claims it will be a GAME CHANGER!!!! I've had my windshield coated for a while now and so far I am impressed!!.
Someone will invariably ask for the differences between Forte and FlyBy30, well let me offer this:
- Similar contact angle and slide angle properties as FlyBy30
- MUCH MUCH easier application
- No need to wait for the product to flash (wipe on/wipe off)
- Scratch resistant
- 2 year expected product life (compared to 6-8 months)
- No more wiper chatter!!
- UV stable & Chemical Resistant
One of the things that bugged me about FlyBy30 was the fact that we had to heat it to create the best results. FlyBy Forte does not require heating WOOHOO!!!!! By far the most impressive part about the product so far is its application. It is truly a wipe on/wipe off. Prep is key, but no more involved than any other glass coatings (..and I've installed quite a few different coating brands from DP to PBL to GTechnic to FlyBy30 and now FlyBy Forte).
QUESTION: Here are a couple of questions that came to mind as I was installing this coating:
1) Can the product be speed cured?
2) Does CarPro have any care and maintenance instructions? Personally, I really don't want a product that requires a lot of "specialized products" to maintain, that would defeat the reason for the product. So far it looks like you can install and walk away (other than regular maintenance) but I would like more feedback from CarPro on the subject.
3) How will the coating be affected if bug guts and bird bombs are not removed right away? Will having bugs or bird bombs left overnight on the coating cause blemishes on the glass (as it does on paint)??
3) The product is said to resist pH of 4 - 12, but how will it react to using a product like Spotless (in case you have water spots and would like to treat it)?
4) I would also like to know how the product behaves with those gas station squeegees.
My Experience: For the last few months its been raining almost non-stop but for some reason since I installed Forte we haven't had a drop of rain. I did want to test Forte, so this morning I sprayed water on the windshield and looked at the beads. Beads were much better on the coated side than the non-coated. I did leave the mist all over my windshield and drove to work. I did notice that the mist required some speed to push the small droplets to create bigger beads, which would then fly off the windshield. As I hit a cruising speed of 55 mph the windshield was almost bone dry ( compared to the uncoated which still had some water). I used the wipers and cycled 20 times and no chatter, skips or anything. I will do a water hose test this weekend (and get some videos) and try and evaluate the difference. I do wonder if the polishing on the uncoated side may have made that portion of the windshield slick enough that sheeting without a coating?!?!. Bead qualities was definitely better on the coated side, and maybe the water shedding properties will progressively worsen as the uncoated side sees more day to day exposure.
FlyBy Forte is NOT a reformulation of FlyBy30 but a whole new design. So Let's introduce CarPro FlyBy Forte
The following was shared in confidence, but I now have the permission to share with my fellow detailers. (This is literally a cut and paste!)
"FlyBy Forte is a brand new technologically advanced windshield coating. Development of Flyby Forte was heavily based on the latest and most advanced mobile phone anti-scratch protection. Our inorganic Nano-tech coating was specifically designed for EXTREME semi-permanent durability and long-term resistance to abrasion and chemicals.
Flyby Forte was tested to over 40,000 real time wiper cleaning cycles, is UV stable, highly chemical resistant, and provides resistance to scratches and minor chips. Flyby Forte is the ULTIMATE in windshield and glass coatings! Unlike traditional glass coatings, which attach to the surface, Forte fully bonds by penetrating the top surface of glass, merging and transforming it into a hydrophobic smooth surface. Flyby Forte does not allow chattering, wiper noise, or degradation of the glass. Rain droplets slide off fast at speeds beyond 50kmh for a minimum of 6 months. Expected durability is up to 2 years."
FlyBy Forte:
Specifications:(from CarPro-US)
• Initial contact Angle (DIN EN 828) : 115 Degrees
• Water drop sliding angle: <20 deg.
• Extreme abrasion resistance
• No wiper chatter
• Repels water, dirt, dust, salt, ice, and snow
• Easy to apply
• Long lasting durable protection
• Harsh chemicals resistant (from 4~12 pH)
• Improves night vision
• Suitable for any glass type: Auto, Marine, Aviation, and more"
Precautions
•Wear gloves
•Note: Avoid applying over rubber trim or to the paint. If product contacts paint or rubber wipe off with wet MF towel immediately.
Directions
•Polish the glass
•Clean surface free of polishing oil residue with CarPro Eraser
•Pour a few drops over the supplied cotton pad
•Apply in circular motion in an organized pattern across the glass and do not wipe off. It will flash nearly invisible as you apply.
•On windshield: Repeat steps 3 and 4 (2 more times - 3 coats total) / On side windows skip this and move to next step
•Using the same applicator (but no additional Forte) once again repeat step 4 buffing off any trace of residue until the surface is 100% transparent and clear.
•After entire windshield is coated, apply Flyby Forte to the Wiper blades and leave wipers off of the glass for at least 10 minutes.
•For side windows only 1 layer is needed.
•Keep surface dry for 4 hours with no wiper blades for 24 hours.
Here is how the product was installed (with pictures to boot)
This is a before picture!
With directions from Corey @ CarPro-US I decided to do a 50/50 split window comparison Forte vs. uncoated
The following are the exact steps I took (after properly cleaning and claying the glass):
- STEP #1 Taped the windshield. I decided to tape because of the warning to remove the product from paint and gasket AND because I was polishing the glass. Saved me from having to be careful, and taping takes no time.
- STEP #2 Inspected the glass and polished the whole thing with LC yellow flat pad and FG400 w/ Flex 3401 speed 6 (5 passes). I only had a couple of minor water spots and that was it. I would have polished even if I did not have any defects, just because it is the most assuring prep.
- STEP #3 Erased the whole windshield and inspected
- STEP #4 Erased again for good measure and did my final wipe with Microfiber Madness crazy pile
- STEP #5 Inspected again (pre-coating) with LED and Flex light
- STEP #6 Applied the product as instructed....... except that the small circles were a pain, so decided to use small fast cross hatch pattern ##
- STEP #7 Continued applying without product (to "buff"), and used my Flex light to inspect at the same time.
- STEP #8 I did clean, Erased x 3, and coat x2 the wiper blades.
Simple right???
I did capture a picture of the product as it was flashing, but in order to do so I had to apply "liberally" (overapply)
Under normal condition, you may see a very faint ghosting
IMPRESSION: This product is RIDICULOUSLY simple and truly fool proof. I was actually frustrated not to be able to see where I had been (since it flashes clear), but the results are stunning. Temperature on that day was 88 degrees with 51% humidity. According to what I've read it makes little to no differences, since it is a wipe on/wipe off. It was great not to have to heat cure. I used more product then needed because I felt I was not using enough (something I had a hard time convincing myself otherwise, even though I knew better). I believe this will be a common mistake and may result in product waste, and end-user frustrations. I personally did NOT like the supplied cotton applicator as they started to delaminate. I suggested to Corey to recommend CarPro include square cotton makeup pads (like the ones my wife uses to remove her makeup). Although I did place a tape line, and applied liberally to and on the tape line, it did not create a product line.... at all!! WOOHOO! I was concerned about getting a product line in my line of sight but coated and uncoated look exactly the same with no visual transitions. So there is no DIY fear that you may end up with a high spot in your field of vision.
Total Time: tape, prep, polish and picture documentation took me a little over 1h30 (because I was taking my time and kept missing the "perfect picture").
WHAT I FOUND: I found that working in total darkness with a single light LED panel was the best. I also found that final inspection was best done with a hand held light source (like my Flex light). I did bring the car out in the sun, but was blinded so inspection was not the best in full sun, however in early light (the next day) I was able to see some area where I missed wiping the product. It came off no problem (interesting!).
Personal recommendationThe alcohol carrier is a little strong, but not strong enough to wear PPE. For good measure I did keep the wiper blades off the glass overnight, and did not use them for >24hrs as recommended. According to the manufacturer, the product should be safe to get wet in as a little as 4 hrs however I personally won't take a chance until we have more testing. I will most likely make the same recommendation as with any other coatings to wait 12 hrs before getting wet. Hopefully with more testing we will be able to confirm the 4hr safe zone.
If this product produces on its claims it will be a GAME CHANGER!!!! I've had my windshield coated for a while now and so far I am impressed!!.
Someone will invariably ask for the differences between Forte and FlyBy30, well let me offer this:
- Similar contact angle and slide angle properties as FlyBy30
- MUCH MUCH easier application
- No need to wait for the product to flash (wipe on/wipe off)
- Scratch resistant
- 2 year expected product life (compared to 6-8 months)
- No more wiper chatter!!
- UV stable & Chemical Resistant
One of the things that bugged me about FlyBy30 was the fact that we had to heat it to create the best results. FlyBy Forte does not require heating WOOHOO!!!!! By far the most impressive part about the product so far is its application. It is truly a wipe on/wipe off. Prep is key, but no more involved than any other glass coatings (..and I've installed quite a few different coating brands from DP to PBL to GTechnic to FlyBy30 and now FlyBy Forte).
QUESTION: Here are a couple of questions that came to mind as I was installing this coating:
1) Can the product be speed cured?
2) Does CarPro have any care and maintenance instructions? Personally, I really don't want a product that requires a lot of "specialized products" to maintain, that would defeat the reason for the product. So far it looks like you can install and walk away (other than regular maintenance) but I would like more feedback from CarPro on the subject.
3) How will the coating be affected if bug guts and bird bombs are not removed right away? Will having bugs or bird bombs left overnight on the coating cause blemishes on the glass (as it does on paint)??
3) The product is said to resist pH of 4 - 12, but how will it react to using a product like Spotless (in case you have water spots and would like to treat it)?
4) I would also like to know how the product behaves with those gas station squeegees.
My Experience: For the last few months its been raining almost non-stop but for some reason since I installed Forte we haven't had a drop of rain. I did want to test Forte, so this morning I sprayed water on the windshield and looked at the beads. Beads were much better on the coated side than the non-coated. I did leave the mist all over my windshield and drove to work. I did notice that the mist required some speed to push the small droplets to create bigger beads, which would then fly off the windshield. As I hit a cruising speed of 55 mph the windshield was almost bone dry ( compared to the uncoated which still had some water). I used the wipers and cycled 20 times and no chatter, skips or anything. I will do a water hose test this weekend (and get some videos) and try and evaluate the difference. I do wonder if the polishing on the uncoated side may have made that portion of the windshield slick enough that sheeting without a coating?!?!. Bead qualities was definitely better on the coated side, and maybe the water shedding properties will progressively worsen as the uncoated side sees more day to day exposure.
For my part, I'll be back to answer your wonderful questions portion of the writeup later!
